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Not clear what you mean by "It's happening now." What's happening?


Welfare, food stamps, Social Security disability


Those three programs are, in most cases, barely enough to live on, especially not to live comfortably. Even if you make good choices, being on welfare and food stamps still provides you almost no opportunities other than getting as many minimum-wage jobs as you can.

You're talking about programs designed essentially to keep people alive and nothing more; to prolong life for its own sake. Minimum income is a way of ensuring that people can remove the stress and worry of being constantly broke and hungry so that they can focus on bettering their lives - going to school, choosing a good job, being able to afford a car, feeding their kids proper meals, and so on.

There is no comparison between the minimum subsistence that welfare provides and the programs that are being discussed here.


Food: The SNAP program spent $76.4 billion in 2013. The maximum amount that a family of 4 can receive is $632/month.

Other: The TANF program spent $33.3 billion in 2013. Maximum benefit for family of 3 in California is $702/month.

Housing: Section 8 Housing Choice Voucher Program spends somewhere around $17 billion per year to provide housing. The maximum voucher that can be received is $2,200/month.

Education: K-12 Public schools are free with free lunches for the poor. Depends on the neighborhood how good the education is.

Pell Grant: The program was appropriated ~$36 billion to award in 2011. Most recent maximum benefit per year was $5,645. Max number of years is six. 6 x $5,645 = $33,870.

In addition, to these benefits if a family does earn an income low enough to qualify for these benefits another benefit is not having to pay taxes. There is a 10% tax on the lowest bracket but it is returned in credits and deductions thus moving the effective tax rate to zero and if the W-4 is adjusted the taxes that will be taken out are almost nil.

If a family received half of the max for each of the items above they could for five years receive ~$1700/month plus Pell Grant money to go to college. After 5 years, TANF is no longer available.


>Those three programs are, in most cases, barely enough to live on, especially not to live comfortably.

So was the stipend in this story. 6k per year, then later 8k? who could live on this


How many people do you know personally who rely on those things to survive? I don't mean people you've met, but people you've grown up with, friends, family, schoolmate, etc. — that sort of thing.

For example, can you name three people you know who have applied for social security disability? How likely is it they'll qualify for it? How long does the process typically take? Who do they have to convince and how?


Apply 3 times and you get it (disability). The amount of people on disability has exploded in the last 15-20 years.

http://apps.npr.org/unfit-for-work/


Those are not nearly enough for someone to exist out of the pit of despair.

Obviously someone against these services will probably think it's too much. Welcome to politics


Dependence.

Turns out that when you incentivize something, you get more of it. Who knew?




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