Forced placement in a facility for treating mental illness until his doctors determine he is sufficiently well to be reintegrated into society, followed by a public-service program as societal (note: not personal) recompense for his actions. That would be after the first time, though, not the third. Because this person needs help and is plainly not getting it--and he will never get help in an American prison.

But because enough people are more interested in vengeance than justice--and your posts pretty firmly demonstrate that you're in that camp--it will never, ever happen.

I'm not interested in vengeance, and nothing about my post suggested I am. I don't want people who are a danger to society to continue to be a danger to society. If I was one of the people interested in vengeance, I'd have said something like they should get raped repeatedly with a broom in prison. I didn't, I just said they should be locked up. Nothing vengeful about that at all. I just want them to not be near my loved ones.

Putting someone in a concrete box where one's safety is utterly left up to chance is nothing but vengeful and retaliatory. It is designed to inflict misery and nothing else. It saddens me that this obvious fact escapes so many of my fellow Americans but I've become resigned to the fact that those of us with privilege are just kind of shitty human beings when it comes to anybody unlike us.

Not every "mentally ill" person is curable, nor can every mentally ill person be trusted at an attempt for re-integration with society.

Funny how you're defending the right of serial rapists to seek help and therapy while you "resign yourself" to the fact that people who don't "get it" are shitty humans.

A huge part of our crimes are things that are hurtful to society and unfair, but completely natural for dominant primates to do to other primates in their group - i.e., take their stuff for own benefit, or violently attack a competitor. Doing evil stuff is evil, but most evil stuff isn't mentally abnormal, and isn't really curable.

Also, crimes such as 'stealing to feed your family' do cross the line, but are neither sign of mental ilness or even evil. Sure, it hurts others as well - but it is a completely sane decision to prioritize suffering of you and your family over wealth of others; if there is a lack of proper social support and a real necessity, a mentally normal person can easily be stealing 365 days a year.

what do we do with "You will certainly have an incurable segment of the population who, after actually being treated by professionals and educated, cannot integrate with society"?

Also, what do we do with those that are extremely violent and prone to escape? It seems reasonable that a tougher layer of security is warranted in some cases.

>"Putting someone in a concrete box where one's safety is utterly left up to chance is nothing but vengeful and retaliatory."

First, I'm not convinced that our prison system is quite as bad as that statement. It seems a bit of hyperbole to me. I'd agree that it certainly isn't great, but perhaps not quite that bad.

Also, it seems that we don't really have to disagree about anything, you are just reading too much into what I've said. I'm in favor of trying to rehabilitate people, and I'm also in favor of improving our prisons. I'd classify someone convicted of rape several times as "an incurable segment of the population who, after actually being treated by professionals and educated, cannot integrate with society."

I also think there are way too many people in prison in general, specifically in relation to the absurd war on drugs. I suspect we agree on that.

>It is designed to inflict misery and nothing else.

I think it is designed as punishment for crime. That mostly seems reasonable. I think while we're at it, we should work to try and rehabilitate them better than we do, but no need to put them in a penthouse suite. Part of it is deterrence. All crime is not mental illness. I promise you that. Much of it is committed by highly intelligent people who just didn't expect to get caught. Much of it is committed by not very intelligent people who just didn't expect to get caught.

Where serious crimes like rape and murder (but not manslaughter) still come with heavy sentences (like 15-25 years) but in a place where you can be rehabilitated so when you get out it doesn't come to a second strike. (Also, the fact that rapists often get sentences under 10 years in this country is pretty ridiculous, and is what allows them to actually get around to committing the crime 3 times. (15 year sentences 3 times starting at age 15 would make you 60. How are people committing 3 rapes in the first place?)

Basically I'm fine with the 3 strike laws as long as we fix the root problems in the first place. (And also fix the definition of felony to not include non-violent, non-serious crimes).