Why do you think dating is off the menu? I know almost-40s that are actively dating. Maybe it's harder in certain areas? I could see this being an advantage of cities...
my tinder has been quiet for years. I’m looking for an attractive mate and I’m 1) not that attractive 2) fat 3) bald(ing) 4) old enough to be the father of those I consider 5) not rich or successful (yet) and worst of all if I got the pretty girl I wouldn't know what to do with her. I don’t want to be that guy. What I want is to go back in time to when I was young.
I guess dating just wasn't in my lot. Everyone gets something, nobody gets everything.
Tinder is murder. I'm 39, male, tall, attractive, fit, educated, etc. in a small-midsized city and it's extremely, extremely, rare to get a match. Very occasionally (1-2x/year, in my experience) things progress to a date/hookup. If you really want to use apps, I'd suggest exploring others. I've had the most success (relatively) with Hinge.
I'd agree with sibling comment that meeting people out in the world can be a lot more fulfilling. You probably know within seconds if you're (physically) attracted to people in the world. Apps can be deceiving.
Keep in mind that in your list of five items, you can manage all of them. If you want it badly enough, you can change #2, and based on your comment I'd argue this (negative self-image) may be at the root here. #3 is not a problem if you don't let it be--plenty of Bic-ed bald guys with attractive mates out there. We are all doled the genes we must live with, but I bet many of the perceived issues with #1 and #3 will improve if you fix #2. None of the women I have dated have cared, at all, about the money I do or don't have (#5). I live in a backyard cottage. I drive a 20 year old car. And as for #4, I can tell you I had a no-strings-attached relationship with a 21 year old for several months last year. She worked at the farmers market, which is where we met. I don't mean to brag, but you need know that each of those items in your list really is in your control.
It's a grind and a slog and it's scary to have conversations with complete strangers. But if it's something you want, I tell you it is possible.
EDIT: I should also mention I'm no "natural". I was terrified of girls in high school, didn't kiss anyone until I halfway through college, was stuck in a loveless long-term relationship for a decade after college because I was sure no one else other than this one person would ever love me, etc. It took a lot of learning and healing to describe myself as I did in the first paragraph. If I could do it, you can do it.
At the end of the day, we've got to live with the choices we make. And the choices we choose not to make are still choices.
And if you can't make yourself make those healthier / better choices even though you know the payoff is worth it, then you need to address the root cause that's driving that irrational behavior.
(Don't mean to sound callous but this feels like the right audience to be hyperlogical with.)
Easier said than done, but trust me it's possible.
Sure, if "wanting someone half your age who's far more attractive" outweighs your desire to not be alone, you're out of luck. But "I'm vain and want a trophy" is a different problem than aging alone.
If you really wanted it you could spend a couple years getting in tip-top shape and expand your pool to more like late-30s and you might have better luck than you think... But you gotta put in SOME effort.
Abandon Tinder. It works for certain demographics but it is amazingly awful for everyone else. You can absolutely still date, in fact I'm constantly surprised by the older people in my life who seem to have no problem finding dates. You do have to have something going for you beyond looks, a certain kind of success which may not be financial.
I'm 40 myself and I find that a lot of the issues with online dating is that pretty much all apps lead with your age. the other thing I've found is that I have SO much more luck in person meeting new people also finding people based on shared interst is pretty much required now, as generalized socializing almost doesnt happen.
for me it's been boardgaming, polyamory meetups mainly... and volunteering to teach things.
it's a muscle, socializing, it's something that improves with use (but also gets exhausted with overuse)
4) old enough to be the father of those I consider
Yeah this is the real problem. Sure everyone wants to date 20 year old models, but you have to be special to do this. You really would have a lot more than no success with people your own age.
as someone who has dated a 20 year old (I was in my early 30's at the time) and met many others her age through social situations... most 20 year olds are just kids still, something I felt at the time and moreso these days... my tastes though really heavily lean towards maturity, it was a weird coincidence we even got into a relationship
And not all 20 y o are models. People with little romantic experience tend to fit better with younger women because women of the same age generally have more romantic experience
I instantly fall in love with someone I sleep with. In fact I make a connection to any girl I deem pretty that makes eye contact on the subway. I feel a little hurt when they get off the train without saying goodbye
No they really don't. This is an idea pushed by sociopaths who are somewhere between trash and downright dangerous. They can't date older women because older women spot their bullshit a mile away and steer clear.
>They can't date older women because older women spot their bullshit a mile away and steer clear.
I think you should stop demonizing men's natural sexual preferences. Key word here is natural, we don't choose what we like. Nature choose for us, and young women are better at having children. Same reason young girls choose tall, rich men, because they are better at surviving and have more resources for raising children.
Nature maximizes reproduction and that's what we like.
We don't know what the default state of human attraction is because we don't have access to a control population of human beings without the same shared societal history of the rest of us.
Which is to say, it's incorrect to broaden your personal attractions to all men, and especially incorrect to try and couch it in some argument of biological naturalism.
Not assuming either point of view here, but just because you cannot run an experiment, doesn't mean that the result of the experiment will be negative. So you don't know if GP is incorrect or not.
I think you should stop extrapolating your personal preferences to half of the world's population, too. Something as varying as sexual attraction can't be reduced to a fixed trait that "nature" has figured out. Indeed we don't choose what we like, and that is fine. You don't have to rationalize your preferences to anyone.
Sadly he is right. Men choose younger as a sign of being able to reproduce. Women, older with high status, because they can reproduce until very late.
Women can't. Over the age of 30 there's severe risk.
The unspoken happy secret behind that point of view is that the ugly girl who loves you will become, in your eyes, the most beautiful woman in the world.
> 20 year-old models aren't all they are cracked up to be.
I'm 65, and I wouldn't expect much from a relationship with anyone under 30. I mean, I can get on with such people; but most of my own foundational experiences occured during the 70s and 80s, so I wouldn't be able to share them. Tastes in music, political and social outlook, these things matter more than raw physical attraction after the first couple of months.
Also, it seems to me that the way people interact has changed; young people talk differently from my generation. I think there's more pressure to be "sociable" in particular ways. About 90% of young women, for example, are constantly texting, and I have to dodge them when I walk down the street, because they have lost all situational awareness.
And arm-candy would be no use to me at all, because I'm the opposite of arm-candy - overweight and balding. I'd be ashamed to be seen out-and-about with a tasty girl young enough to be my daughter.
I'll chime in with some CanCon courtesy of the Northern Pikes:
Her ego wrote cheques incredibly fast
But her personality didn't have the cash
I laughed out loud to my total dismay
She ain't pretty she just looks that way
What song is that? What came to my mind was 'If you wanna be happy for the rest of your life' by Jimmy Soul which is a doo-wop song you couldn't write anymore.
I don't remember and can't seem to find it. I remember people talking about the song more than the song itself, so it would be hard to recognize it. But the Jimmy Soul one makes the point well enough: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6EqFVWzOfN8
I do not disagree with you. I’m in a happy relationship, but if I wasn’t I’d rather be single than settling with someone I wouldn’t find attractive just because they were “attainable”.
You can absolutely still have children, but you're going to have to settle slightly on aesthetics to find a woman 30-35 who considers you in her league.
(also, just lose some weight, even if you don't get fit. it's an incredible level-up.)
This comment is reminiscent of a funny interview Larry David did on Conan:
> My problem is that I was very particular, which is odd because I was very desperate at the time. (...) You'll find that a lot of desperate people are very particular, like even Quasimodo. The hunchback had to have the best looking girl in the village. And then his friends would like and fix him up. They'd go "Quasi, there's a very nice girl in my office, a wonderful personality; I want to introduce you to her." (With a bizarre voice:) "Is she good looking?" "But Quasi! You're a monster! You're a heinous beast! What are you talking about?!" (Same bizarre voice:) "She has to be good looking."
That’s very funny and true but it makes sense. You want your offspring hopefully to be more attractive than you are, in addition to other beneficial hereditary traits. And its a competitive play, since each successive generation seems to be more attractive generally, with the losers of each round childless. So you’re leveraging your other qualities to the maximum without going too far and ending up with nothing. Its a gamble
Honestly, you're in the second best age group for women in their 20's and 30's. Daddy issues are rife. Looks don't matter much either.
Really, being able to talk will get you a lot farther than a six-pack and full head of hair. Trying to meet people on the hookup apps is an exercise in frustration for most people though, just go outside and be social.
I think your problem is setting your standards unreasonably high. It may be time to focus your energy inward on exercise and self-care, as a confident and well rounded man is far more attractive to many.
Actively dating means they are not building good relationships. My experience so far is women over 30 are dead inside and way less attractive which means I'm not willing to go to much effort for them. I'm mid-30s, look a little younger than my years and relatively good looking so getting dates is pretty easy. But finding that "spark" that starts a relationship is a completely different matter.
They lose their looks but maintain high standards for men. This leads to them waiting for a man who is less and less likely to appear with each passing year. Many want children but know it's already too late. The clock has run out. The fire is gone. Many are on anti-depressants or in therapy etc. After many relationships they seem to lose their ability to bond with a man. And most of them don't truly get any fulfilment from work, hobbies, friends etc. Not having children is a huge void in their lives which they often fill with cats.
The sentences at the start might be brutal but true. However...
> Many are on anti-depressants or in therapy etc. After many relationships they seem to lose their ability to bond with a man. And most of them don't truly get any fulfilment from work, hobbies, friends etc. Not having children is a huge void in their lives which they often fill with cats.
I think you're projecting some very unhelpful stereotypes. Women aren't just breeding machines. Nothing wrong with therapy. And I know many who are doing just fine with work, hobbies, friends, etc.
