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They are welcome to, just declare it upfront.


I have a hard time imagining something more destructive to the ability to run an organization than putting forward all managerial initiatives for public consent, just in case some portion of the public disagrees with that choice. Talk about design by committee.


> Talk about design by committee.

aka Wikipedia.


>I have a hard time imagining something more destructive to the ability to run an organization

How about eroding public trust? I can think of a lot more. Perhaps your imagination is subject to a hidden bias.


Yeah, not going to happen, and for good reason.

This is really no different than people who whine about what people receiving public assistance buy. It is an attempt to leverage money in to control, and it is gross.

If you don't like what Wikimedia does, don't give them money. If you do, great, but donations don't buy line-item veto privileges.


What does "declaring it upfront" look like, what are you asking for? Like, a copy of their budget before donating? I think you can probably get that?


Wikimedia budgets are pretty public btw. Much more public than for many other NGOs, IMO. But I think the poster wants personal explanation of every single expense and a line-item veto power for their $30 or however much they donated. This of course is impossible for any organization. In fact, it's good that it's not possible - imagine how would it be to run the organization of this size subject to the whims of any random commenter on the internet.


I can't find any line-item in the Foundation Audit Reports named "parties" though. Is it under "other operating expenses"? How can I know how much of those $9M was spent on parties?


Do you want a line-item for how much they spend on office coffee-per-person too? Surely parties can't be the only thing you are concerned about.

There does seem to be a line "Special event expense, net". I would guess parties go in there? It was reported as around $300K, or 0.2% of expenses, in the most recent fiscal year.

https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/foundation/f/f7/Wikim..."

I cannot tell you how much they spend on office coffee though. I bet they're wasting it on unecological kuerigs and gourmet brands. It's probably a reason not to donate.


It really depends how much the coffee costs. Like with Putin's palace, people wouldn't complain about the toilet brushes if they weren't gold-coated. Is the coffee bought from Mahers cousin? Sure, I'd like to know that.

Parties do not have to be funded by the company. During my lifetime, I never went to a company-funded party. But I have been doing fine, funding my own parties. What do you need? A stereo and a disco ball. Anyway, how can you spend $9M on stereos and disco balls? It warrants scrutiny.


And how can we know how much the coffee costs without a line-item?

It is clear you don't trust how wikimedia is going to use your money, so you shouldn't donate to them. Nobody is forcing you, certainly.

I don't think any line-items or "declaring it up front" is going to satisfy you though. Most people don't seem to agree with you. I don't think it's really a reporting or "declaring it up front" issue.

Where is your "$9 million" figure coming from though?


I think the $9m they're talking about is the 2019 expense for "other operating expenses" in that budget statement you linked.

It's... probably not the category that's relevant, since they're complaining about parties that happened at conferences, which would presumably be accounted under "travel and conferences" which is just $3m for 2019.

"Other operating expenses" _would_ probably include things like a staff party, based on the definition at the end of the document, but that's not where the complaint started. More to the point, it also includes "facility expenses, funding of the Wikidata project, staff related expenses, insurance and personal property tax expenses, and other general administrative expenses", so claiming it as a party slush fund feels rather weird when it's almost certainly the category that includes things like office rent.

(I know nothing at all about the WMF's accounting practices, so I'm just reading the document and extrapolating.)


I'm not sure where the idea that there were fancy parties came from in the first place?

Just the line "so many memories of so much dancing, from Accra to Berlin to Chandigarh"? When I read that, i was imagining her dancing just in clubs or at someone's house with other wikipedians, in the evening after a conference or meeting. I certainly do expect the CEO of wikimedia to do international travel to meetings and conferences of various sorts, it is a global organization! When I travel for conferences and meetings, there is usually entertainment in the evenings, whether formal (part of the program) or informal (people going out on their own with fellow meeting/conference attendees). That's a normal thing, I think?

But maybe the complainer has more info to think there were expensive parties going on? (I also expect wikimedia to have banquets and parties and such, yes, around the world, so that wouldn't especially disturb me, but not sure where the idea even came from).


I think you should assume that every charitable organization you are donating to might throw the occasional party for their administrative employees and will certainly throw parties to attract donations.


Having worked for both a small and a mid-size charity (~50, ~500 employees), and known people at others, in my experience an annual "staff party" or similar is usually fairly low-key. People are very aware that the money comes from donations.

Why have the party at all? Because spending €20 or whatever per employee/volunteer on an annual party has benefits beyond increasing everyone's salary by that amount: job satisfaction, employee/volunteer retention, knowledge sharing etc.

Fundraising events are parties for the guests, but work for the charity staff. (Attend the party, introduce Rich Person X to Foreign Princess Y who promotes our work and went to the same university, mention the proposed project in Country Z if she doesn't, etc.)


None of this is in contrast with what I'm saying, no? I would expect an international organization (like Wikimedia) to throw small "staff" parties all over the world, and maybe the CEO would come to some of those to give members at that location recognition.


Do shareholding and dividend statements generally say such things upfront?




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